New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Raves, rants, and comments about the 2011 uniform change
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Errol Feldman
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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by Errol Feldman » Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:45 am

bcbagheera wrote:Yes, unfortunately nothing will get changed for too long. And yes, it is a dead horse, but that does not mean the deficiencies go away.

{snipped as irrelevant}

Untucked, wrinkled shirts may be more comfortable, but in no way look better.
I watched the AGM formal meeting last Saturday afternoon; can not say our top leadership looked really presentable when you consider that we had guests from WOSM World Committee, and the top leadership from ASC , all formally dressed with shirt tails tucked in.

I may be old fashioned, but hanging shirt tails just doesn't hack it. You wouldn"t dress that way for a presentation at Rideau Hall; or maybe THEY would...
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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by ayates » Fri Nov 23, 2012 8:23 am

Errol Feldman wrote:or maybe THEY would...
I the photos from the parliament hill marketing splash last winter, the powers that be looked like slobs. Especially in photos next to the MPs in suits.

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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by Sam Wallis » Fri Nov 23, 2012 8:49 am

The shirt tails bother me, anything above cubs is cut to be tucked in. I cant see wearing it untucked. the Cub shirt looks like its cut to be untucked, and the beavers uniform, well, I just dont know what to make of it, never have.

But, to wear a shirt with tails untucked to me is only fine relaxing in your own livingroom, if you dont have guests.

thats more a function of the wearer than the uniform though. you could wear that tan to look like a slob if you wanted.
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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by Rick Gruchy » Fri Nov 23, 2012 8:54 am

Errol Feldman wrote:I watched the AGM formal meeting last Saturday afternoon . . .
I cannot say that I disagree about shirt tucking. I only wore my new shirt untucked once; it was about 30 degrees and I was leading a campfire . . . I almost melted. Otherwise I am a tucker. I was at the the AGM last weekend and was sitting next to a large group of Vents & Rovers who were there taking the Youth Spokesperson Training. You will very pleased to know that they all had their shirts tucked in and they all looked fantastic. It was obvious to me that these youth were really liking their new uniforms and were taking pride in their appearance in them. Something I have not seen in a while.

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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by firedog_53 » Fri Nov 23, 2012 9:00 am

I like shirts tucked in, especially for Leaders and Rovers and Venturers, ... If they are wearing the Traditional shirt. Today's fashion says Golf shirt and the like should be left untucked.
Not so sure that "Yoga pants and shirt tucking" go together though?

FD

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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by Sam Wallis » Fri Nov 23, 2012 9:05 am

yoga pants should not be worn with something tucked into them. thats true. yoga pants should not be worn to scouts anyway IMO
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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by whuggard » Fri Nov 23, 2012 9:11 am

Why not?
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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by Rick Gruchy » Fri Nov 23, 2012 9:20 am

Sam Wallis wrote:yoga pants should not be worn to scouts anyway IMO
What if you are doing Yoga? :lol:

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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by Sam Wallis » Fri Nov 23, 2012 10:14 am

Rick, thats not on my list of things to do with cubs.

Whuggard, I dont like them personaly. they look less classy than say bib overals and an undershirt with tabaco stains, but thats my opinion, your mileage may vary.
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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by whuggard » Fri Nov 23, 2012 1:08 pm

Less classy? I disagree. Whats the difference between them and the baggy sweats all my male Cubs wear? They are comfortable so who cares?

Google 'yoga pants for kids' - the first 6 returns are all major retail chains who are marketing the pants to girls.

My wife and oldest daughter (8) live in them and I expect my youngest (4) will too once she is older - and none of them do Yoga. They tell me they are very comfortable and they love wearing them.

No, tucking in a shirt is not an option in them - so maybe not appropriate for the old tan shirt...but no one wears that anymore... :P

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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by Sam Wallis » Fri Nov 23, 2012 2:05 pm

I saw people wearing the tan untucked. looked bad. had a leader tell me it was optional for females to tuck it in. still looked bad. the red looks bad untucked.

as to yoga pants, maybe my thoughts are based on my 16 year olds friends, but maybe they just buy the wrong size. thats just too tight.

my cubs mostly wear jeans. to me, leaders should tuck in the shirt, and if your not wearing pants you can tuck it into, then change. but, thats just my opinion.
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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by norma » Fri Nov 23, 2012 4:51 pm

Has anyone measured a red shirt against a tan shirt?

If you do you will notice they are cut *exactly the same*

National agrees that the tan shirt is "cut" to be tucked in. So how can they say that the 'cut' of the red shirt is *designed* to be worn either? :lol:

If the intention was to cut the shirt so that it could be worn either, in reality this has not happened. The red shirt is cut identically to the old tan shirts. Therefore, they are "cut" to be tucked in.

The grey Cub uniform shirt, it is "cut" differently. It is cut in a manner that is typically not tucked in. But from Scouts up all the shirts are cut in a manner that is worn tucked in.

The 'tech ts' are also a cut that is typically worn untucked. But most leaders look more 'professional' if they wear it tucked in. Though I have heard some youth teasing their parents (who are leaders) for wearing their t-shirts tucked in.

To me, it is all about respect. Respecting others to take the time to look after yourself. And respecting yourself by doing your best to look after yourself. It is like the old "paws and claws" inspections at Cubs. Showing that you were willing to respect yourself enough to look after yourself.

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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by Sam Wallis » Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:17 pm

Norma, well said. we do the paws and claws to this day in cubs.
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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by firedog_53 » Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:20 pm

norma wrote:The 'tech ts' are also a cut that is typically worn untucked. But most leaders look more 'professional' if they wear it tucked in. Though I have heard some youth teasing their parents (who are leaders) for wearing their t-shirts tucked in.
I too, agree with the "tucking in" HOWEVER ... I am old, thats the way I was taught and the rest of the folks did it too. Look around the world, ties are now something deemed not important.. shirts are untucked and even hang below jackets, something that was never done. Heck, the lawyers here can tell you that dress codes have or are falling away even in the courthouses.

We have leaders worried about "tucking in a shirt" and they stand in front of their youth in jeans, with their hands shoved into their pockets, wearing a greasy, grimey old ball cap.

Honestly think we have more issue to deal with than this. I do think if Leaders set a better example with their dress and grooming, that youth might see it as an example.

just my two cents..
FD

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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by LoyalistMang » Sun Nov 25, 2012 9:29 am

norma wrote:To me, it is all about respect. Respecting others to take the time to look after yourself. And respecting yourself by doing your best to look after yourself. It is like the old "paws and claws" inspections at Cubs. Showing that you were willing to respect yourself enough to look after yourself.
Inspections are considered "old"? Really? I wonder how much of this tucked vs. untucked debate would exist if more Packs were still doing the inspections. We do them every week and the kids earn points for their six. At the end of the year, the six with the most points earns a prize of some sort.
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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by firedog_53 » Sun Nov 25, 2012 10:40 am

LoyalistMang wrote:I wonder how much of this tucked vs. untucked debate would exist if more Packs were still doing the inspections. We do them every week and the kids earn points for their six. At the end of the year, the six with the most points earns a prize of some sort.
That is a great idea, as long as you consider and accept all the uniform options Scouts Ca and the parents and the youth accept as "norm". You shouldn't penalize a youth for wearing the uniform the way it was intended or designed or promoted. That is almost the same as a leader saying "only tan shirts will be allowed, because that is what I like best!" ..

FD

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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by LoyalistMang » Sun Nov 25, 2012 11:16 am

firedog_53 wrote:
LoyalistMang wrote:I wonder how much of this tucked vs. untucked debate would exist if more Packs were still doing the inspections. We do them every week and the kids earn points for their six. At the end of the year, the six with the most points earns a prize of some sort.
That is a great idea, as long as you consider and accept all the uniform options Scouts Ca and the parents and the youth accept as "norm". You shouldn't penalize a youth for wearing the uniform the way it was intended or designed or promoted. That is almost the same as a leader saying "only tan shirts will be allowed, because that is what I like best!" ..
Absolutely. The effect of peer pressure is pretty impressive, too. The group has 26 youth, with 4 or 5 in the new uniform. They all neatly tuck their shirts in for inspection, opening and closing. They know it looks sloppy and want to be as sharp as the rest. A couple have asked if they have to and we've told them that it's entirely up to them because of the design. They get tucked. ;-)
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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by norma » Sun Nov 25, 2012 1:04 pm

LoyalistMang wrote:Inspections are considered "old"? Really? I wonder how much of this tucked vs. untucked debate would exist if more Packs were still doing the inspections. We do them every week and the kids earn points for their six. At the end of the year, the six with the most points earns a prize of some sort.
From what I see they no longer do "paws and claws". As in use that terminology. Or if they do inspect the Cubs hands and nails, then the Cubs around here are 'failing' the inspection every week. Their hands are atrocious.

I do hear of a lot of groups doing inspections, just don't seem to be as common or as 'strict' as they were when my brothers were in Cubs and I heard weekly about the "paws and claws" inspections.

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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by Sam Wallis » Sun Nov 25, 2012 1:47 pm

we would penalize a cub in the tan for not tucking, but not in the grey. the rest, well inspections are done by the sixers, which is painfull both from a time and quality perspective. still the winning six gets a prize, and they are not just rewarding their own six. the claws are iffy at best.
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Re: New Joe Fresh Uniforms Really Disapointing

Post by LoyalistMang » Sun Nov 25, 2012 2:56 pm

Sam Wallis wrote:we would penalize a cub in the tan for not tucking, but not in the grey. the rest, well inspections are done by the sixers, which is painfull both from a time and quality perspective. still the winning six gets a prize, and they are not just rewarding their own six. the claws are iffy at best.
Exactly. It's funny, but even though subtracting points penalizes their own six, some of these kids are real sticklers. :lol:
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