Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

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SusieMackie
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Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by SusieMackie » Tue Aug 10, 2010 2:48 pm

Issues Facing Scouting - Criminal Background Checks
Chief Commissioner Steve Kent appears on CBC's The National to weigh in on this significant issue facing our volunteers.
http://www.cbc.ca/video/#/News/TV_Shows ... 1556110459

Online story http://www.cbc.ca/politics/story/2010/0 ... hecks.html

Scouts Canada is committed to ensuring all prospective volunteers' background checks are completed swiftly, thoroughly, and with as little cost or inconvenience as possible.
As you know, the safety of our youth is our number one priority, and all members must provide clean PRC before working with youth. This includes a Vulnerable Sector Check for pardoned child sexual offences. Especially now, with our commitment and determination to grow Scouting in Canada over the next few years, it’s critical that we make the joining process as easy as possible for potential volunteers.

Our concerns regarding the status of PRC screening in Canada include:
o Cost in some areas for volunteers from low income families
o Time factor
o No consistency across the country – sometimes takes multiple weeks to get PRC
o Inconvenience

We do appreciate the ongoing cooperation we have had and the excellent relations we share with law enforcement agencies, and the support they have given us in so many other ways.

To address the issue of swifter PRCs, Scouts Canada attended a meeting with RCMP and public service agencies in January which would allow 3rd party screening companies to access Vulnerable Sector Checks. This is currently awaiting government approval - but our Chief Commissioner is on this problem and has lobbied the Minister for swifter action.

We welcome your thoughts on this topic of relevance to all Scouting members. Share your ideas, your experiences, your comments.

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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by ayates » Tue Aug 10, 2010 2:57 pm

We are at least lucky that the local OPP do not charge us for the regular PRC. Worst case for us is that the registration fee will go up by ~$3 a kid to pay for these extra checks. Leaders won't be sitting on the sidelines while waiting because as long as they are supervised it is OK to have them involved.

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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by richsong » Sat Aug 21, 2010 4:33 am

Did you see the news on Friday? The RCMP will now require fingerprint confirmation of identity for any person working with children, when the adult has the same birthdate as a registered sex offender. The standard fee for fingerprinting is an additional $25.
This change is intending to prevent criminals from changing their name and thus bypassing the security of the PRC.

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Robert D White
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Robert D White » Sat Aug 21, 2010 10:39 am

Richsong,

Our Council Commission alerted us to this at the beginning of August. There was a story in The Record (Waterloo Region) outlining some of the challenges this is creating: http://news.therecord.com/article/764772.

The one thing I agree with is Greg McCarthy's statemtent:
He’d also like the RCMP to try and find a new way to conduct these checks.

“I’m going to be going through this the rest of my life if they don’t change the policy or find a better way of doing it,” he said.
This may be a challenge for Scouting as well, since we require PRC's every three years.

My renewal was due in December but I started the process this week just in case.
Robert White
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Karl Wagner
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Karl Wagner » Sun Aug 22, 2010 4:43 pm

I'm concerned that many leaders, myself included, would view fingerprinting in order get a PRC too much of a hassle and huge invasion of personal rights in order to satisfy Scouts Canada's insurance policy, especially on a PRC renewal for a leader who already has 3 or more years of track record working with youth. If they asked me to be fingerprinted I would seriously consider walking away from being a leader.
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Errol Feldman
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Errol Feldman » Mon Aug 23, 2010 2:44 am

Karl Wagner wrote:I'm concerned that many leaders, myself included, would view fingerprinting in order get a PRC too much of a hassle and huge invasion of personal rights in order to satisfy Scouts Canada's insurance policy, especially on a PRC renewal for a leader who already has 3 or more years of track record working with youth. If they asked me to be fingerprinted I would seriously consider walking away from being a leader.
Unfortunately Karl, in today's world I would much rather that a potential Leader walked away if he/she refused to be fingerprinted for the PRC. There are too many cases of people getting back into Scouting in different areas because of the lack of a good link. Scouts Canada doesn't was its "dirty linen" in public, but the newspaper reports over the last few years show us SOME of what is happening.

IF this is the only way of keeping the perverts away from the kids; so be it. And thre. six, nine, or even my 55 yhears as a Leader is NOT a garantee that my hands are clean; but a PRC regularly is as good as it gets...here in Europe my Leaders are all Military doing jobs requiring clearance to the highest levels; they also get PRC's if the want to be leaders. AAND I have a couple of Light Colonels and a full Colonel amongst my leaers.
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Karl Wagner
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Karl Wagner » Mon Aug 23, 2010 8:09 am

The only thing a PRC guarantees is that the person hasn't been caught.
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Errol Feldman
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Errol Feldman » Mon Aug 23, 2010 8:33 am

TRUE!!!
But at least, for what it is worth, that is better than someone who has been caught and is trying again :oops:
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Brandon » Wed Sep 08, 2010 8:53 pm

Would it be possible within the next two years to have a system put in place where Scouts Canada can in such a way handle the requests?

Such a system may be either...
A) Scouts Canada has access to a portal where they enter the information of its volunteers such as drivers licences and such and it is then processed through the police station as usual but instead is given through one system and handled by possibly multiple police stations across the country?
OR
B) Scouts Canada is given a portal where its members can go to provide ONLY the police with all their information although Scouts Canada does in the end receive like A the information but a one stop location essentially is provided. Thus eliminating the need to go into the office and what not?

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Karl Wagner
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Karl Wagner » Thu Sep 09, 2010 7:55 am

Brandon, they have such a system already. Scouts Canada works with a third party to provide this service, myBackCheck. The only problem is, with this latest set of federal changes to Vulnerable Sector checks, you still have to print paper, hunt up an "Organization Representative" to attest that the documentation and images are actually of you, then find a fax machine and fax everything to myBackCheck. It's actually less of a hassle to walk into your local police station than it is to do myBackCheck.

I speak from experience, since I paid my money to go the myBackCheck route, and only after I had paid my money did I discover all the extra red tape that is actually taking longer to work through, and costing more.

Our Council site talks about how easy it is, but it is very misleading.
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Brandon » Fri Sep 10, 2010 5:58 am

Thats very interesting, I was not aware of any such process. I of course never looked since I assumed they might have told me while I went through the process of getting my PRC. I guess I can be glad though that I did not use this option!

Thanks Karl!

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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Robert D White » Wed Sep 22, 2010 11:04 am

For those tracking these things: My PRC comes due in December. My son, who turned 18 this year, is a Pack Scouter and needed to get his PRC done. So, in the third week of August, we trekked down to the local police station to start the process.

Today, I received a letter from said police service which reads: "Your police record check was conducted and the Vulnerable Sector Check is 'inconclusive'" (sic).

So, now I have to go through the RCMP process. We'll see how long it takes.
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Errol Feldman » Wed Sep 22, 2010 11:22 am

Robert D White wrote:For those tracking these things: My PRC comes due in December. My son, who turned 18 this year, is a Pack Scouter and needed to get his PRC done. So, in the third week of August, we trekked down to the local police station to start the process.

Today, I received a letter from said police service which reads: "Your police record check was conducted and the Vulnerable Sector Check is 'inconclusive'" (sic).
So, now I have to go through the RCMP process. We'll see how long it takes.
?????????? What does THAT mean ????????????
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whuggard
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by whuggard » Fri Sep 24, 2010 6:46 pm

Likely someone with the same name or someone using an alias similar to your name has a criminal record and the process is required to confirm you are not that criminal. A simple fingerprint scan should clear it up.
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Errol Feldman » Mon Oct 11, 2010 3:50 am

This E-Mail was posted to a list where I am a member. I enclose the E-Mail and my reply, in the hope that somebody here knows the answer. In the meantime I have also posed the question to Baseline. I have removed all names, including the List name, except my own.
From: "Wise Old Wolf" <oldwolfgilwell@kpnmail.nl>
Subject: Delays expected for PRCs
> That IS a very good question, I think I will ask TPTB what the answer
> is.
> Although I would bet that there would be less than 0.05% that would come from outside the group, and anyone coming from within the group would be well-known to all the kids and Leaders. OK, I agree that is NOT an answer so I am going to ask...let you know what answer I get.
> Errol
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: XXXX@XXX.XX>
>> SC is touting 18 year olds as prime leadership material.
>> At 18, their PRC is meaningless.
>> Any criminal record they might have is sealed by law.
>> Up to age 18 they are protected by law from having such records
>> revealed.
Errol Feldman
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scoutleader101
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by scoutleader101 » Mon Oct 11, 2010 3:56 pm

Errol,

The statement originally given by the person is incorrect because the criminal record of a person less than 18 is now no longer unavailable. Besides a PRC leaders must also go through a Vulnerable Sector Check. A VSC is much more thorough and INCLUDES any criminal record including those of a young offender. Here are some references:
http://www.yrp.ca/community-policing/ho ... ening.aspx
http://www.hamiltonpolice.on.ca/HPS/Ser ... Search.htm

There are NUMEROUS other references confirming this.

Garth
Alberta

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Robert D White
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Robert D White » Mon Oct 11, 2010 4:37 pm

whuggard wrote:Likely someone with the same name or someone using an alias similar to your name has a criminal record and the process is required to confirm you are not that criminal. A simple fingerprint scan should clear it up.
Actually it means someone with the same birthdate as mine has a criminal record. Because this is a Vulnerable Sector Check, it means the record is related to either a sexual offence or the person is on the sexual offenders registry.

I've already gone in for fingerprinting and am just waiting to see how long it takes for the process to be finalized.
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Errol Feldman » Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:59 am

scoutleader101 wrote:Errol,

The statement originally given by the person is incorrect because the criminal record of a person less than 18 is now no longer unavailable. Besides a PRC leaders must also go through a Vulnerable Sector Check. A VSC is much more thorough and INCLUDES any criminal record including those of a young offender. Here are some references:
http://www.yrp.ca/community-policing/ho ... ening.aspx
http://www.hamiltonpolice.on.ca/HPS/Ser ... Search.htm

There are NUMEROUS other references confirming this.

Garth
Alberta
You are right, verified by Sect.119 of the CYJA.
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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by scoutleader101 » Sun Oct 17, 2010 11:42 am

In my council, if an existing leader with no previous problems, gets caught up in the delays then they're being allowed to continue working with youth. New leaders have to wait for the clean PRC, whether or not there is a delay caused by the new process.

Garth
Alberta

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Re: Criminal Background Checks (PRCs)

Post by Robert D White » Wed Nov 24, 2010 10:49 pm

For those who were following this, I received word today, from the local police services, that:

1) My vulnerable sector check has been forwared to Central Escarpment Council

2) MY VSC was performed by the RCMP and came back negative.

3) And I was sent a copy of my fingerprints for future reference.

Was fingerprinted on September 28, cleared VSC came back almost two months later. Began the process in August so the whole process took about four months.
Robert White
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