Leader education

Last year when I was voluntold I was the new Cub leader, I freaked out. I had no clue what was involved in such a position. I had been a part time beaver leader for 2 yrs prior to that. My quest for knowledge had begun!!! BTW, it was one of the best things I have ever done as it helped me focus on something else for a change.
I signed up for WB1 and found the course to be ok but not really what I was looking for. I could have spent the weekend, or at least a couple hours of it, online or with a text book of sorts and learned everything they told me in that 3 day course. Most of the information would have been just as interesting in a text format with a test at the end. Aside from the great fellowship, I felt my time and that of the instructors had been wasted. Not a good feeling for a new leader.
My group struggled (we had many other issues happening) for the rest of the year but I was proud of myself for putting on a pretty good program considering the obstacles.
As the Scouting year approaches, I felt I needed more hands on practical knowledge. I signed up for the WB2 and had to convince the commissioner to let me go. It was explained to me that a WB2 should only be taken after 1 year in that section. I had a problem with that answer. When I went to nursing school, I completed a 3 yr program before I got my first job. My instructors in nursing school didn't give me some of the information I needed and then sent me out to the workforce and expected that I would come back to school for the rest of my education after I had some experience. Its backwards. I take my role as a cub leader very seriously and I want to teach my cubs what they want and need to know. If I don't have that knowledge base, how am I supposed to do that???? Why is my role as a leader so different than my role as a professional?
I know that not all leaders think this way and many would argue that going to courses is too time consuming. But I also believe that if we are to grow and thrive as an organization, education is the key to success.
Just as a side note, I have signed up for the WB1 in troop as another leader and I are planning to start a troop in the fall.

It is not uncommon for training programs to include practical experience mixed in with course work, co-operative education being a prime example. Woodbadge I should give a person a basic ability to understand what they are participating in and how to be effective as an assistant section Scouter. Once a person has some experience with a section, Woodbadge II helps them to gain a deeper understanding of the section. Participants can share their experiences and relate what is being taught back to what they have already seen first-hand. This makes the training much more effective.

Liam,

You state exactly why we still need training where Leaders meet. As beneficial as web-based training may be for subjects like Risk Management or Scout Canada's Mission and Vision, it won't replace Leaders getting together and sharing experiences and ideas.

Have to disagree with you Robert. I do NOT believe in web-based training (but then I am a Rebel anyway) for any of the Wood Badge subjects. There must be an opportunity to discuss and explain, face to face, not with "canned" answers on the Internet. The internet is great for basic information and explanation; the Leaders must have the opportunity to discuss these points with other Leaders. In my experience, the course leaders are usually very experienced Scouters who have had to do with all the different matter, in varying degrees, being taught, and as such, are in a position to clarify and explain immediately. This can tend to broaden a discussion which, in my opinion, is a very healthy situation. IF there is not sufficient time during the oeriod itself, it can always be further discussed during a meal, or coffee, break.

Traditional Woodbadge I is an ideal, one that new leaders should be encouraged to take, but the harsh reality is that many new leaders don't have that option.

Our area, Nipissing, attempts to hold Woodbadge I once a year. We're a small area, only four active groups, but we're one of the more active and successful ones in Northern Ontario council. This year we won't be holding a Woodbadge I, but encouraging those without to go to a course hosted by Sudbury Area. The turnout from our area won't be as good because it's a long drive and none of our groups had input into the date, so several have events planned for that weekend. Those Scouters who can't make it, and any who join after that October date, will be leaders for at least a year before they have another opportunity to take it.

Northern Ontario Council has about 36 groups in an area the size of France. About a third of those groups are rather isolated, many hours by road from a neighbouring group. New Scouters at those groups will have next to no opportunity to take Woodbadge I without a drive of four or more hours just to get there. I suspect that many of those Scouters just get by, by following their section leader or if they are the section leader by doing the best they can.

So obviously taking a traditional Woodbadge I course is something a significant minority of Scouters in Northern Ontario won't be able to do no matter how beneficial it will be. And that situation probably applies to an equally significant minority in many other councils.

So while traditional training is an ideal, for many new Scouters Web-based training may be the only training they are going to get. So instead of knocking it, we should be working to make it as good as we can.

To help illustrate the point, a year or two ago there was a some silly Internet chatter that SC had a new policy that required Scouters to get their Woodbadge in their first year or they wouldn't be allowed back for year two until they were trained. Well, if such a policy ever came to pass half the groups in Northern Ontario Council would probably have to close for lack of leaders, and I won't speculate on how many groups in other councils would have to close. And that in a nutshell is why SC needs a Web-based training option.

I have to agree with you Scouter Ken. Web based learning is becoming a big need and not just because of distance. Many people need alternate ways of learning for so many reasons. The northern part of any province is probably in the same predicament as you. many people also have time challenges to deal with; our lives are busier than before with work (often shift work), our kids are in multiple activities or sporting clubs and other service groups. While the networking is a positive and beneficial part of training, it's not the most important part. If we expect leaders to stay with scouting, alternate learning methods need to be explored. If Scouting doesn't keep up the times, it is bound to suffer.

Scouter Ken,

Some silly Internet chatter that SC had a new policy that required Scouters to get their Woodbadge in their first year or they wouldn't be allowed back for year two until they were trained.

This "silly chatter" is policy now. Not sure what your AC is doing about it, but the AC in Wellington Area is serious about following the policy. But we're in a different situation. With a number of Areas within the Central Escarpment Council and an effort by the Council's training person to coordinate WB 1 sessions, there is no excuse for a new Leader (or a veteran Leader who hasn't a WB 1 for the section they're leading) to not have attended a training session within their first year.

Earl,

I do NOT believe in web-based training (but then I am a Rebel anyway) for any of the Wood Badge subjects. There must be an opportunity to discuss and explain, face to face, not with "canned" answers on the Internet. The internet is great for basic information and explanation; the Leaders must have the opportunity to discuss these points with other Leaders. In my experience, the course leaders are usually very experienced Scouters who have had to do with all the different matter, in varying degrees, being taught, and as such, are in a position to clarify and explain immediately. This can tend to broaden a discussion which, in my opinion, is a very healthy situation. IF there is not sufficient time during the oeriod itself, it can always be further discussed during a meal, or coffee, break.

I agree with you. However, Scouts Canada seems determined to add a Internet-based component to WB 1 in order to shorten the time needed for a face-to-face course. To that end, I'd suggest only "information-based" sections of the training be placed on the Internet. Anything else needs to be done in a group situation.

The company my wife works for has a number of Internet-based training courses (for which they get credit if completed) but cover topics like the Workplace Hazardous Materials Information System (WHMIS). It seems to work for them.

there is no excuse for a new Leader (or a veteran Leader who hasn't a WB 1 for the section they're leading) to not have attended a training session within their first year.

Actually, there is one very good excuse: Most of the people that I have talked to who have recently come back from WB training locally have said it was a waste of time. A responsible organization does not try to waste precious volunteer time. Instead of focusing on getting people to take training, they should focus on making the training good enough that people want to take it; we need carrot instead of stick.

It's not going to do any good if Scouts Canada starts terminating the memberships of valuable volunteers.

In any case, I don't understand why they are focusing on trying to get everyone to take WBI training. Far more important is to ensure that every section is lead by someone with WBII. WBI qualifies one to be an assistant section Scouter. It's just Part 1 of 2. I wouldn't want my cavity filled by someone who has taken only the first half of dental school.

Liam,

Actually, there is one very good excuse: Most of the people that I have talked to who have recently come back from WB training locally have said it was a waste of time. A responsible organization does not try to waste precious volunteer time. Instead of focusing on getting people to take training, they should focus on making the training good enough that people want to take it; we need carrot instead of stick.

Good point. Here's what I know the Central Escarpment Council is trying to do:

1) Follow BP&P which says just because a Leader has a lot of experience, it may not necessarily mean that person will be a suitable trainer. A suitable trainer is someone with both experience and an aptitude to teaching and mentoring.

2) Provide training for trainers. The new TD1 program (and I was fortunate enough to be chosen for the first session three years ago) is designed to give trainers the skills they need to make sure training is not boring or a waste of time.

This isn't to say the situation is perfect. But I believe it can and will get better.

In any case, I don't understand why they are focusing on trying to get everyone to take WBI training. Far more important is to ensure that every section is lead by someone with WBII. WBI qualifies one to be an assistant section Scouter. It's just Part 1 of 2. I wouldn't want my cavity filled by someone who has taken only the first half of dental school.

But neither would I want a dentist filling my cavity if they hadn't even taken the basics of dentistry.

I've been asked to lead the Colony section of training this year. My goal is that each leader will leave the weekend with enough information and resources to run a meeting if they were left in charge. From this they will have the confidence to lead their youth, work as part of the leadership team and eventually, with further training (WB II) be prepared to take a leading role in Scouting.

Your right Robert, that "silly Internet chatter" is indeed a policy now, which promotes it to the "silly policy" level.

Me bad for not staying up to date with BP&P, and SC bad for creating such a silly policy.

It's silly because it is not enforceable, certainly not in Northern Ontario Council, and probably not a lot of other councils as well, and the negatives of enforcing it (disinterested Woodbadge participants, or more likely fewer leaders) significantly diminish the positives.

Please note my criticism is not of training which I think entirely worthwhile and necessary, it is of a policy that simply can't be enforced throughout vast stretches of Canada, probably only in urban settings. Training has to be positively promoted and accessible -- but in SC training is negatively promoted and inaccessible to many.

Perhaps the policy was intended to help prepare the ground for a Web-based Woodbadge I, but I doubt that.

Liam, you may think section leaders should have WB II, and that WB I only qualifies scouters to be assistant leaders, don't be offended but that just has me shaking my head. Maybe in your world in southern Ontario, but that's not my world.

We haven't had a WB II in Nipissing in at least 10 years and I couldn't say when it was last offered by Northern Ontario council in an area accessible to us. Among the four groups here, I can think of only one Scouter with beads still working with a section. And it wouldn't surprise me if one or two groups had a section leader who had yet to take WB I.

I know Nipissing is not the only area in Northern Ontario in this situation, and I doubt that Northern Ontario is the only council that has these issues.

So keep traditional Woodbadge courses, both I and II, "in person" to prevent watering down standards. Then standards will be watered down by leaders who can't access courses, that is until they're told they can't be leaders because they didn't take the courses. Then we won't have to worry about standards because there won't be a program -- unless you live in a populous region like southern Ontario or B.C.'s lower mainland where some groups will likely survive.

there is no excuse for a new Leader (or a veteran Leader who hasn't a WB 1 for the section they're leading) to not have attended a training session within their first year.

Actually, there is one very good excuse: Most of the people that I have talked to who have recently come back from WB training locally have said it was a waste of time. A responsible organization does not try to waste precious volunteer time. Instead of focusing on getting people to take training, they should focus on making the training good enough that people want to take it; we need carrot instead of stick...

Perhaps this problem is not one of trainee, but rather trainor...
The problems faced by Canada Councils can NOT possibly be greater than the problems faced by the "outwith" Canada Councils. Especially considering that most of our Scout(er)s rotate every three to four years. YES we do have a few permanent residents here and they form the core of our Training team.
We use our most experienced Scouters as Trainers (BTW, most have at least Trainer II now), and set up courses on the specific needs of the new Scouters. (Of course we include the soup, along with the real meat and potatoes, but after a full weekend session (Friday evening to Sunday afternoon late) of Wood Badge I most, if not all, of the candidates have more than a working knowledge of what is required in their section.
We strive to ensure that ALL our new Scouters receive their Warrants on B.-P.'s Birthday at opur Annual Feast. AND YES, we issue the Warrant only AFTER WoodBadge I is successfully completed. It seems to work; maybe because our Scouters are Military and used to taking courses...Our Group is sponsored by the Commanding Officer (personally) Canadian Forces Support Unit in Europe (AWACS Geilenkirchen).

Sorry to skip back a bit, but there were a few things noted that warrant highlighting. There are groups that are being lead by WB1 leaders, and someone said WB1 training was wasting their time. I agree with the time waster and even extend that up to WB2. It may not be the trainer or trainee, but what is being taught. There has been other threads that talk about this. I think this ties in with the relevance for Scouting issue as well. Some of the best, most engaging leaders never took training, and some of the worst leaders I have seen have a bag full of beads (I gather there is WB training past 2). As a thought, should the level of training or what is being taught not be gauged to the persons abilitiy? I think the WB course are standardized, which may not apply across Canada or even regionally (urabn vs. rural). Course selection can be maybe an internet thing, with a face-to-face follow-up?

I would extend that statement to the effect that most sections are operated by leaders with only WBI. Thus either WBI needs to give the leaders the skills to run a section, or leaders need to be made to take WBII at the same time (assuming that covers the section running skills). Telling a prospective leader that they need to dedicate a month of weekends to training is not going to fly, so WBI needs to give the leaders the tools they need.

Having recently taken a Venturer WBI course, I can attest that little of the content relates to the running and programming of the section. This is not the fault of the trainers, if anything I have seen the trainers become much more professional over the past several years, but the content they are required by national to cover.

A leader needs to come out of WBI knowing how to run a reasonably safe, but exciting program for the kids in their section. All the "airy fairy" stuff (e.g. WOSM video, diversity video, etc) needs to be ripped out of the content to make room for teaching the leaders things that will benefit the kids under their care.

I concur with your thoughts on the awarding of beads. In some cases beads are awarded based on who you know versus what you know. It's a status symbol for some people.


Allan.

Recently, I took WB1 in troop. Now having taken 2 WB1's in less than a year, I can tell you not all courses are the same. The first one I took was essentially a snoozefest but the second one was amazing! I was astonished about all the things I learned. Even the "dry" content was made interesting. When I got home, I realized something- the instructors essentially treated us as a colony, pack or troop. We played games, used small groups and large groups plus many other things that are essential to a good meeting. Even our nightly campfires were instruction based - one was formal, one was informal. So even boring content can be made fun and helpful if given the right twist.